Comments for Why Did God Command Evil Deeds? at http://www.thecatholicthing.org , comment 1 to 16 out of 16 comments http://www.thecatholicthing.org Sat, 18 May 2013 08:32:06 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1775 Based on a reading of the text (Numbers 31) it looks like God ordered vengeance on the Midianites without giving details. It was Moses who interpreted this to mean the slaughter of the male children. 15 \"Have you allowed all the women to live?\" he asked them. 16 \"They were the ones who followed Balaam\'s advice and were the means of turning the Israelites away from the LORD in what happened at Peor, so that a plague struck the LORD\'s people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. - Ron Sun, 17 May 2009 22:44:34 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1701 I don't think that Mr. Novak really dealt with the primary objection : What about those instances where God seems to not just tolerate but command what are objective injustices ? A prime example would be the prophet Samuel denouncing King Saul for not killing all of those 'under the ban' in a town. If the Lord were trying to move the Israelites away from such barbarity, wouldn't He approve of such a move, rather than denounce it as disobedience? - Donna Thu, 07 May 2009 18:54:03 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1693 How I deal with it. God is the author of life, and all life belongs to him. He cannot unlawfully take someone's life (murder) because he is the owner of all life. The same with him ordering someone to kill someone else. The very term murder cannot be applied to God, becuse it implies an unlawful taking of a life. - anthony Wed, 06 May 2009 17:43:58 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1671 Re: the defeat of the Midianites. It was the same with Sodom and Gomorrah. The Lord knew that these people were completely beyond redemption and corrupted by the demonic "gods" of the time. They were a threat to The Lord's salvific plan of establishing a nation that his annointed (Christ) could spring from. Yes, even their children were evil. We see this with today with Islamic terror groups. Yet today they're redeemable because of Christ's sacrifice. We see the roots of just war concept. - JediGraz Tue, 05 May 2009 19:10:28 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1659 I think the point Lex is making is indeed a good point which Novak does not seem to address, one which is the crux of the problem. The fact that God commands murder...not that he allows it, but He commands it. If murder is immoral now, it was immoral then (unless you are a Divine Command Theorist, which I am happy to reject). There might be an answer to this. It is based on whether God 'really commanded' murder. What sense of Scripture is this "command"? Literal?Analogous? - Andrew Tue, 05 May 2009 09:49:15 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1654 Your point touches on a tendency modern humanity has of looking at the past through the eyes of the present. In addition to God revealing His ways and His will to us over time, the events written about in the Old Testament need to be understood in light of the times in which they occurred. Looking at them with the eyes of the past may reveal those Israelites, while seemingly barbaric, to be the most compassionate people of the era. - John Hamm Tue, 05 May 2009 06:28:53 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1652 It's also not necessarily the case that we are judging God by his own laws. Rather, we are reading Yahweh's POSITIVE COMMANDS of genocide in the Old Testament in light of the natural law and find Yahweh lacking, to say the least. Obviously the scope and duration of the command aren't the same, but it's hard to differentiate the Biblical Israelites from Islamic jihadists, except that the jihadists are far more compassionate! I'd take Bin Laden over Joshua anytime! - LexEtLibertas Tue, 05 May 2009 06:25:42 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1651 I have to say this is a huge stumbling block for me as a Christian. I accept the inspiration and the inerrancy of Scripture on faith, based on the authority of Christ and His Church, but I find Novak's repetition of the standard explanation to be shallow, even disingenuous. No, we DON\'T find God \"gradually revealing\" more humane laws. Rather Yahweh apparently COMMANDS genocide from a people who, however fallen they are, don\'t really wanna do it because it grates against their moal fiber. - LexEtLibertas Tue, 05 May 2009 06:24:55 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1650 I'm the e-mail correspondent that Professor Novak refers to. I do thank him for responding. Just one observation. Progressive revelation only works for defects of omission. God could tell us some principles now, more later, and that would be fine. But what He did with the Midianites was contradict moral principle. The Israelites saw that killing children was wrong, tried to refuse, were overridden. Analogies about progress fail here. The only progress possible is to reject the order from God. - Dean Brooks Tue, 05 May 2009 06:24:31 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1647 Wil, I too am not convinced. I think it is dangerous to draw conclusions about roots from observations of the fruit. The correspondent gave himself far too much credit (as we all seem to in this day) for drawing conclusions based on very little information. Imagine the vast amount of contextual, cultural, political, information that is not present for us in the Old Testament. This confusion seems to be what happens when we try to answer questions of revelation with logical thinking. - Achilles Tue, 05 May 2009 06:23:24 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1645 another question for all of you regarding us poor beings trying to know & love the Infinite I AM: is it possible that the One Who is Love, in His Mercy allowed these deaths only to redeem these very dead when He decended into Hell? i am not baiting anyone, i grew up Protestant & know NO theology about saving the dead. its just that if i believe Scripture(which i do) He is always longing for union with us all-Always! so, maybe we dont see His mercy in the middle of these Scriptures. please respond - debby Tue, 05 May 2009 06:22:05 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1640 God used human authors to transmit his word to us, humans subject to the mores and practices of their milieu. That is why He left us a teaching Church to teach us the proper interpretation of scripture. The Church does not teach us to murder our opponents, kill their children, etc and never has. Follow the Church magisterium and don't worry about this kind of thing. - william j quinn Mon, 04 May 2009 10:09:47 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1639 In Hosea 13:4, YHWH speaks: "I have been the LORD your God/Since the Land of Egypt . . ." And in 13:15 we read--I believe it is still the LORD speaking--of Samaria's guilt: "For she has rebelled against her God./They will fall by the sword,/Their little ones will be dashed in pieces,/And their pregnant women will be ripped open." I guess the question is whether or not this constitutes a command. - Brad Miner Mon, 04 May 2009 08:36:35 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1638 You write, "to the commands of Yahweh to bash the heads of captured infants against stones..." While my PhD is in New, not Old Testament, I'm wondering if you're not thinking of Ps 137 -- "Happy is he who takes your little ones [Babylonian infants] and dashes them against a rock!" These are the words of the Psalmist, not the words of YHWH; I can't think of anywhere in Scripture where YHWH directly commands what you suggest. But it's possible I'm overlooking something. - Irenaeus Mon, 04 May 2009 08:14:16 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1637 G K Chesterton said " Madmen have no doubts." That's good because this morning I have doubts. What happen to the "Natural Law" when the slaughtering occured at the command of God? Was this law, written in the hearts of men, suspended or was there some sort of anthropological shift? What is so different here from the slaughter engaged by Islam at the behest of Allah? This was a very poignent article. I am not sure I am convinced by the conclusion. TCT enlighten me please in future articles - William Dennis Mon, 04 May 2009 07:36:31 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2009/why-did-god-command-evil-deeds.html#comment-1635 I teach in a Catholic high school and encounter the polygamy and violence question often. Why would God tolerate such barbarity? Your article confirms a response I've developed to this query: "Would your parents tolerate you soiling your pants when you go home tonight? No? Well, there was a time when they did. Perhaps even thought it 'cute' as they changed your diapers. But, over time, gradually, you had to grow out of that, get potty trained, etc." Thanks for your added insight. - Mark Reilly Mon, 04 May 2009 07:34:57 +0100