Comments for Deeply – or vaguely – Catholic? at http://www.thecatholicthing.org , comment 1 to 9 out of 9 comments http://www.thecatholicthing.org Wed, 22 May 2013 17:10:07 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4564 An excellent tonic for American Catholics is the encyclical of Pope Leo XIII "On Liberty." Leo wrote: "And as to tolerance, it is surprising how far removed from the equity and prudence of the Church are those who profess what is called liberalism. For, in allowing that boundless license of which We have spoken, they exceed all limits, and end at last by making no apparent distinction between truth and error, honesty and dishonesty." - Dan Hammond Tue, 27 Jul 2010 07:43:09 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4550 I too think often about Jesus telling the Pharisees: Its not enough for you to not get into heaven yourselves but you also bar the way for those who are following you. E.g., on 5/17/09, Fr Jenkins of the Holy Cross fathers made a mockery of honoring Obama at NDU and then, adding insult to injury, has refused to drop charges against those who (peacefully) demonstrated against it. He has tried to cover himself with the figleaf of "its not the university that is pressing charges but South Bend" which the city of South Bend denies on the grounds that the demonstrators were on NDU property. In 2010, Catholics have become so used to this duplicity by those in gov't and academia that no one is scadalized anymore. Fr Jenkins (et al) serenely retains his post, our taxes are used to kill children and Catholics in the pews have less & less idea who to believe or follow. The Pharisees had nothin' on us. - gb Sat, 24 Jul 2010 06:48:51 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4549 Don't despair, Mr. McCarthy - you may be correct about the 5% (although I would put the percentage a little higher), but not about the age. There is a sizable, and growing, number of young families, most of whom have three or more (mostly more)children, many of whom home school, who are committed to making the faithful practice of Catholicism the center of their lives. I am personally acquainted with at least a dozen such families here in the most liberal city of a very liberal state. By all means keep praying, but also remember that the Gates of Hell will not prevail. - James Milliken Sat, 24 Jul 2010 04:04:12 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4548 Reading this magnificent essay, and the excellent comments which followed it, I am of the opinion that Fr. Bramwell speaks for no more than 5% of current Catholics, and most of them are, like myself, well over 50 or 60. Mrs. Marinoni is on the right track. First and foremost, this is a time for prayer. - John McCarthy Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:41:20 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4542 In the post-modern era, those in charge wish to be or at least appear to be reasonable. Given a polarity such as secularism on the one side and "fundamentalism" on the other, the contemporary civic leader attempts to find a center position between the poles, a reasonable compromise. A Catholic civic leader who thus promotes abortion because it seems reasonable under the contemporary circumstances is in essence a modern Philistine (some are indeed scribes and a few are Pharasitical). Jesus was very clear about the dangers of being salt that has lost its taste. Faith must be in concert with reason, but it can not contained by reason because too many fundamentals are beyond our intellect. For those mysteries we have revelation, however imperfectly rendered by human transmission. Reason is a toolkit, not a blueprint. Excellent article. - Joe Thu, 22 Jul 2010 12:39:25 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4541 Thank you for this! I have just finished reading an ex-Mason's explanations of the one world-one religion Masonic cult that appears to have successfully reached into many Catholic institutions and also into the Vatican. I was wondering how much truth is in the assertions and five minutes ago I read your article, so clearly expressed, and all the dots joined up. We have to fight back at our individual level; mine is that of an elderly housewife. At the very least fight with the Rosary, with faithfulness to Holy Mass (protest when your friends describe it as: "Wasn't that a lovely service?"!! Praise your PP when he gets things right but ask for clarification when he shows ambivalence and political correctness in his sermons. - Mrs. M. Marinoni Thu, 22 Jul 2010 11:22:42 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4540 Father Bramwell is right -- personnel is policy. To the extent the personnel aren't Catholic, it's not clear what it means to call the institution Catholic. I do believe there are sometimes very good reasons for Catholics to involve non-Catholics in running their Catholic institutions, but those reasons must be carefully articulated and justified. As Fr. Bramwell makes clear, the liberal neutrality model is the kiss of death for authentic Catholic institutions. At the very least, non-Catholics working for Catholic institutions must be deeply committed to supporting what is distinctively Catholic about those institutions; in addition, they must also bring something else that specially enhances the Catholic mission of the institution. To give one example, where I teach (Villanova Law), the serious scholarship of an Orthodox Jew on Jewish law greatly enriches our collective dialogue on law's relationship to religion. I've often told the story of a perverse interview I had some years ago for a position on the law faculty of a (nominally) Catholic university. The dean prodded me to say something about what "Catholic identity" entailed. I resisted, knowing that I was being entrapped. Knowing that I wasn't going to get out alive, I finally capitulated, opening with the careful conditional, "IF you claim to be a Catholic law school . . .", and was interrupted by my interrogator: "But we don't claim to be a 'Catholic law school.' We claim to be a law school in a Catholic university." Surer than ever that the fix was in and was final, I replied: "You have a problem with your Venn diagrams." Needless to say, I didn't get the job. More recently, I have tried to say something constructive about what it means to be a Catholic law school in my essay "Bologna Revisited," which is available at On the Square over on the First Things blog. - Patrick McKinley Brennan Thu, 22 Jul 2010 08:30:58 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4539 In a post-modern, relativistic, pluralistic society, it is increasingly common for us Catholics to think of our religious beliefs and practices as representing one particular perspective out of many, perhaps just as valid as others. We could think of them as having been worked out by a few men (and even fewer women), most of whom lived out of the mainstream, a cloistered existence in the Vatican or some monastery or convent. It takes real faith to see our faith as representing revelations given for our guidance and instruction, and as having the power to free us from sin and bring us into full intimate relationship with God. It is particularly hard because they are administered through imperfect humans. Yet they originate with and are protected by the Triune God. This is exactly what our faith purports to be. May we all embrace it fully and increasingly come under its transforming power. Thanks for the reminder, Father Bramwell! - Tom Cabeen Thu, 22 Jul 2010 06:53:11 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2010/deeply-or-vaguely-catholic.html#comment-4538 Father Bramwell's article is all too true, which is why there are now catacombs within the Church populated by those working in ostensibly Catholic institutions who suffer because of their orthodoxy at the hands of those in positions of authority who are heterodox. - Anonymous Thu, 22 Jul 2010 06:13:49 +0100