Comments for Their Proper End at http://www.thecatholicthing.org , comment 1 to 5 out of 5 comments http://www.thecatholicthing.org Sat, 25 May 2013 10:38:34 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2011/their-proper-end.html#comment-6732 Mr Miner, Thanks for your excellent thoughts. I would grant your claim that many members of the Catholic hierarchy have not sufficiently emphasized the intrinsic significance of the rule of law in their interventions in the immigration debates. But do you think it possible that Cardinal George and others are not in fact unaware of the importance of the rule of law, but are posing a higher-level order question about the justice of those laws? Or, could one take this a step further, and suggest that the concern is not with law at all, but the fundamental attitude one bears for one's neighbor? Even if we must discuss what is prudent and practical within the limits of political life, are we nevertheless not called as Christians to criticize and elevate worldly politics in the name of something better? This would seem to be the message of Labor Exercens and Centesimus Annus. Again, I grant that in the immigration debate a false choice is often offered between law and justice, but that might be because of the very low view of justice on offer. - Bill McCormick Tue, 10 May 2011 01:35:43 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2011/their-proper-end.html#comment-6728 Mr. Miner, I am equally reluctant to "agree with the Cardinal that the anti-religious bias in popular culture was substantially accelerated after September 11, 2001, when terrorist attacks in the name of God led many in the media to conclude that the very existence of religion – any religion – had been 'proved' to be the principal cause of violence on earth." I think it far more likely that the terrorist attacks in the name of religion simply allowed a far larger proportion of those who already held that opinion in some form to feel free publicly to express it. I also share your disagreement with his disregard of the distinction between legal and illegal immigrants. As I have expressed in a number of , this nation has already departed far enough from the Rule of Law to cause myself and others grave concern about her future viability. For a Churchman to encourage such a cavalier attitude towards the Rule of Law is disturbing. Keep up the good fight. Pax et bonum, Keith Töpfer - Martial Artist Mon, 09 May 2011 08:07:08 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2011/their-proper-end.html#comment-6727 Brad: Yes of course - I know that Fordham is not under Card. George - I am asking the broader question. Are Catholics at Fordham and in New York and other places likely to get a grip on themselves, and withstand the moral/theological insurgency in Catholic educational institutions, without actions by the epicopacy, logically proceeding from the same inspiration that causes them to write books and statements? It'll be interesting to see what Arch-Bishop Dolan does is response to the USCCB Committee's statement re: Sr. Johnson at Fordham, just as it'll be interesting to continue to watch Card. George oversee things at Catholic colleges in Chicago. While I was pleased to see the recent news of disciplining Fr. Pflieger, it seems like that was out of control for a very long time, doesn't it? - Chris in Maryland Mon, 09 May 2011 07:19:14 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2011/their-proper-end.html#comment-6726 To: Chris in Maryland You ask some interesting questions, none of which would be within the responsibilities of Cardinal George: Fordham comes under the authority, I assume, of Archbishop Dolan. As for the Cardinal, he recently removed the priestly faculties of Fr. Pfleger, which is a pretty good example of getting a grip. -ABM - Brad Miner Mon, 09 May 2011 06:46:56 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2011/their-proper-end.html#comment-6725 How do/Are the institutions of the Catholic Church in America operate/operating to assure that Catholic people become/remain the Salt of the Earth? Among related questions - do self-marketed "Catholic" colleges/universities hold that they are part of the institution of the Church? For example, if Sr. Eliz. Johnson of Fordham authors a textbook on theology that the USCCB Committee on Doctrine cites as "not accord[ing] with authentic Catholic teaching on essential points," and ignores her duty to Catholic parents and students to seek and publish with an imprimatur, and Fordham approves the book for study by "abroad audience" of Catholic students at Fordham, this is harming the Church as a whole, and Fordham's Catholics. Actions like this militate against Catholics "com[ing] into possession of themselves," as Cardinal George put it. To put it a little more plainly - if Card. George wants Catholics to "get a grip on themselves" it looks like The Church is going to have to "get a grip" on institutions like Fordham. The March 11, 2011 statement by the Committee on Doctrine is a good first step. My question is - what happens after that? - Chris in Maryland Mon, 09 May 2011 06:30:49 +0100