Comments for Reflections on Rape and Abortion at http://www.thecatholicthing.org , comment 1 to 16 out of 16 comments http://www.thecatholicthing.org Sun, 19 May 2013 03:34:20 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13139 For people who support abortion for rape victims the assumption can be made that they were conceived consensually. I am not in the position to know what happened during my conception or how I was conceived. I think we all like to assume that we were conceived out of some sort of loving union yet one can only assume that this is not always the case. If conception occurs outside our notions of how conception should socially occur does that make the fruit of that union something less than human? - michele Sat, 25 Aug 2012 22:45:16 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13134 In trying to enact legislation, one looks for a possible consensus among a majority of the legislators. If we cannot pass the "perfect" law, we should not sacrifice the possible on the altar of the ideal. - TeaPot562 Sat, 25 Aug 2012 15:16:51 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13122 @Dan: "The situation is a very difficult one that calls on a woman to be heroine and to overcome violence with love." Despite the typo I have to say that this is the most beautiful statement about the situation that I have ever read...thanks Dan! In every situation we try to accomplish the most good that can be accomplished. That usually means steps to the goal. However, I agree that our language should never confuse the issue or give ground. I think i heard Ryan say that Romney's position was a good step in the right direction...perfect example of this point. Doesn't concede the issue of abortion in case of rape but doesn't try to inflame either. steps to the goal. - Louise Fri, 24 Aug 2012 15:49:27 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13121 It's not the baby's fault that her father is a criminal. Prosecute the criminal to the fullest extent of the law. Absolutely. But for what other crime do we execute the criminal's child? Nine months is a significant length of time, but it pales to the forever of death. It's not the baby's fault. - nitnot Fri, 24 Aug 2012 14:11:03 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13120 "The logic is unassailable." You said everything there is to say there. A country which murders millions of children to avoid fifty women feeling more traumatized than they will no matter what is evil to the core. Every Catholic in this country is a bad Catholic for not fighting a guerrilla war against the most evil murderous nation in human history, the United States. Since we're always forced to explain and pro-baby murder people never have to defend anything, for once, can they explain something for me? How, scientifically, does abortion trauma heal rape trauma? - Jacob R Fri, 24 Aug 2012 14:09:37 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13118 So George Bush is better because he would allow fewer abortions than Barack Obama? Sounds like a Hitler v. Stalin argument to me. - Walter Fri, 24 Aug 2012 07:51:37 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13117 Because, Grump, contraception as a solution to high infant mortality rates means that you've decided that no one in areas of high infant mortality should ever get pregnant. Becuase the infant mortality rate would be the same, if there were any infants at all. How about, instead, providing those societies with clean drinking water and adequate nutrition and rudimentary medical care? Infant mortality rates would decline precipitously, and non-infants would be healthier as well. - Richard A Fri, 24 Aug 2012 06:30:05 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13116 To paraphrase Flannery O'Connor: if rape abortions are okay, then the hell with it, all abortions are okay. We have given away the intellectual argument once we give in to rape-incest exceptions. What if we said certain concentration camp gasings were okay, like for children or the weak? The neocons seem to want everyone (especially "prolifers") to be contaminated with the conviction that you can be "a little bit" pro-abort. (No coincidence that the Repub candidate shares those pesky exceptions?) On the other hand, the leftists seem to be setting Akin up as another Joseph McCarthy. "Legitimate Rape! Have you no sense of decency!!!" when the phrase was clearly used to mean "legitimate claim of rape", which Tawana Brawley and the Duke Lacrosse accusers unfortunately established the need for. So at any rate, if the sexual left can project their own problems onto Akin, just as the political left did onto McCarthy, they can then demonize *anyone* who holds a pure prolife stance, just like McCarthyism is used as a club to keep anti-Communists in line. Would that the neocons (and I'm including National Review fans and Buckley acolytes) would had have stood by McCarthy. For one thing, Frank Marshall Davis would have been marginalized as a Communist (he slipped by Congress after McCarthy was put down), and we wouldn't now have the Obama problem. More broadly, the sexual and political revolution that followed McCarthy might have been aborted if the scaredy-cat pseudo-conservatives hadn't shown that they were capable of running for cover whenever someone said "Boo! McCarthy!" We were tested then, and found flaccid. What about now? Stay with Akin, who stuck his neck out. I'm going to up the ante and say we should refuse to call *anyone* prolife if they hold rape-incest exceptions. Abolish abortion, now! - Sue Fri, 24 Aug 2012 06:04:30 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13115 I disagree with the notion that this is somehow a complicated issue for politicians to tackle. In fact, that is what got Rep. Akin into trouble: he danced around the issue and then compounded it because of utter ignorance about how a woman's body functions. This type of hesitation is what gets politicans into trouble. Say what you mean and mean what you say. In the end, I believe that the American electorate respects candor, and can see through all the hysteria in the media that responds to supposedly controversial positions. What if Rep. Akin had said this, instead of spouting his 'shut down theory of legitimate rape': "I believe the God-given right to life is inviolabe, and that abortion for rape victims should be outlawed because of the fetus' right to life. I also believe that a rape victim who bears a child can experience the joy and love of motherhood that far outweigh the trauma of both the rape and an abortion." What's so hard about that? - DS Fri, 24 Aug 2012 05:34:19 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13114 The problem is the rape, not the pro-life position. Abortion does not undo the emotional devastation of rape. Once a woman has been raped, the damage is done. Many, many women who have aborted children conceived in rape suffer substantial additional emotional trauma as a result of the abortion -- it is not uncommon for them to say that the abortion was worse than the rape. The situation is a very difficult one that calls on a woman to be heroine and to overcome violence with love. Those who do often find that it is the most noble and enriching act of their lives. - Dan Fri, 24 Aug 2012 04:07:59 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13113 Granted, Austin, that a baby in the womb is precious. However, looking at the child mortality rate, approximately 8 million children and infants under 5 die annually, mostly in developing nations. According to the UN, two-thirds of these deaths are attributable to respiratory diseases, diarrhea, measles, malnutrition and malaria, all of which are preventable. While each child arguably (in my case) is a "gift from God," where was God when the children died? Meanwhile, thanks to contraception, between 1990 and 2008, pregnancy and abortion rates in the U.S. for women in their twenties dropped dramatically -- pregnancy rates fell by 18 percent, while abortion rates dropped by a third. What logic is there in opposing birth control, which has had a significant impact on reducing the number of abortions? - Grump Fri, 24 Aug 2012 04:05:36 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13110 Similar to making the argument you propose is to simply ask the questions, "Suppose I were to agree that abortion is justified and acceptable when it comes to the hard cases, would that be acceptable to you? Would you then agree that it is not acceptable otherwise" The answer to both of these questions, for most pro-abortionists, would be "no" - demonstrating that the argument was never really about the hard cases at all. - rtjl Fri, 24 Aug 2012 01:19:50 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13109 There's an argument used by pro-aborts that goes something like this:    Premise: There's a miniscule chance a woman will be raped and then become with child.    Conclusion: Abortions on demand for everyone! The kerfluffle over Rep. Akin's remarks are having an effect unanticipated by the pro-aborts and their Democrat party insiders. Many, many people are starting to look at that argument with a clear head and finally seeing that it never made any sense. Add to that that the once-feared social stigma of being a victim of rape is, if it happens to females, almost nonexistent. The force of the similarly-structured Girl In Trouble argument is also nearly gone. With the widespread acceptance - even social and government support for - unwed motherhood, the claim that a pregnancy will ruin her chances for a good education blah blah blah is rather weak. And it's weaker when an ever-growing number of colleges and universities (even Catholic ones!) have on-campus day care facilities - never mind the high schools! - Micha Elyi Fri, 24 Aug 2012 00:42:42 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13108 One may legitimately support legislation that curtails abortion, without thereby approving of exceptions that are necessary to secure its passage. Political reality may mean that an incremental approach is the only avenue open to legislators. This involves no abandonment of principle, especially, if the politician in question makes clear his own commitment to the toal elimination of abortion - Michael Paterson-Seymour Thu, 23 Aug 2012 23:48:50 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13106 Thanks Mr Ruse a great perspective. - Jack,CT Thu, 23 Aug 2012 21:51:10 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2012/reflections-on-rape-and-abortion.html#comment-13105 It is important to distinguish the moral and religious from the legal considerations with regard to abortion. For example, if a legislator had the deciding vote for passing a law prohibiting abortion except in the "hard cases," would it make sense for him cast the defeating vote because of his moral/religious objections to all abortions? - Howard Kainz Thu, 23 Aug 2012 19:34:12 +0100