Comments for Notes for the Etiquette of a New Age at http://www.thecatholicthing.org , comment 1 to 15 out of 15 comments http://www.thecatholicthing.org Wed, 19 Jun 2013 02:15:21 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15409 @Layman Tom, your points are well founded and I too wish Cardinal Dolan would visit this page and explain to us why the Church does not take action against Catholics of national political prominence taking positions and supporting legislation contrary to Church teaching. At the end of the day, however, whatever polite debate that once existed over these matters deteriorated to the exercise of bare knuckle application of power as the Left has always embraced the mantra, "by any means necessary." It has been argued that the primary reasons behind exposing the sexual abuse cases by priests stems primarily from the Church's position on abortion, gay marriage, homosexuality etc and that the Left has used this as a weapon to marginalize the Church's voice. THIS IS NOT TO SAY these abuse cases should not have been exposed. The Church is better for removing pedophile priests and letting due process and justice run its proper course. Our Cardinals, Archbishops, and Bishops clearly understand the additional secular fury unleashed on the Church if the likes of Pelosi, Biden, Sibelius, O'Malley and the Cuomos were either denied communion or excommunicated. But then, I would hope that our leading clergy would also understand that the Church was born in deception (Judas), doubt (Thomas), denial (Peter), retreat and fear (all of them right after the death of Christ), death and resurrection (Jesus Christ) then divine empowerment at Pentecost and dispersion through persecution. If we can accept that the Church has been and will continue to be persecuted, then perhaps our clerics will accept the inevitable and act. Until then, I agree that the Church is a paper tiger. - Frank Fri, 18 Jan 2013 00:53:03 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15397 Well and bravely said, Dr. Arkes. I quibble only in the matter of the quote about a structure belonging to one of the many denominations as "the National Cathedral." I do wish you had reminded the reader that since we do not have a national church, we have no national cathedral. - Mack Hall Wed, 16 Jan 2013 14:49:20 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15388 In keeping with my previous comment, how about, "Oh dear, the future can't handle too many of those." - Louise Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:38:44 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15387 WWVS For those not in the know, I'm referring to Violet in the tv series "Downton Abbey"; she has so many witty zingers up her sleeve. I suspect Richard A may be one of her fans. - Louise Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:23:28 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15386 @Jacob R KILLS! I don't care who ya are. That's funny right there! It’s all the more impressive as this is a pretty somber topic. Thanks for the chuckle. It seems that my opinion about the piece is in tune with most of you. I'm not sure why the Church is timid about enforcing her rightful expectation of adherence by the adherents. Particularly those members who ostentatiously use their power and prestige to flaunt their disregard for everything she stands for. I wish somebody would explain this to me. I would love to see Cardinal Dolan or one of the other bigwigs pen a guest column on TCT and explain exactly why we tolerate these bozos. Could it be that the USCCB is afraid to make enemies in the halls of power and the media? How's that working out for them? It’s called the war between good and evil, not the tea party between good and evil. It’s time to strap in and take care of business. If that means we have to part ways with former troops because they won’t march to the drumbeat anymore or worse they now wear the enemy’s colors, so be it. Catholicism is not a faith of convenience. So for those recalcitrant officials, there must still be something in the church that they want, some need they are getting fulfilled. Otherwise they'd have all left for the First Church of the "Whatever is Popular Now". So assuming there is something that they are getting out of being catholic, it only makes sense that it should be denied to them as long as they continue to trash the church and all she stands for. I know that I'm not perfect. I'm a broken sinner. I try, and I am truly, truly grateful for the grace God has showered on me and for the fact that the Church is my refuge and accepts me, faults and all. However, I have no power or influence and my sins, though an affront to God, are not corrupting others and are not publically assaulting the precepts of morality or the Church's authority. If they were, I would expect the Church to boot me out into the street. Actually, I would be man enough to remove myself. I know it is not ours to judge men. However we can judge their actions and their words. If they act to destroy, and are smugly proud of that, maybe, just maybe the church has cause to smack them down. Adhere is the root word of adherent. If you won't do the verb, (or at least try really hard), you don't deserve the noun. -Peace - Layman Tom Tue, 15 Jan 2013 08:59:34 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15385 @Michael Paterson-Seymour: "...that is, by apostolic succession and a valid Eucharist, are true particular Churches." Thank you for your comment Michael, but you make my point as the Churches referred to are the Orthodox Churches which do indeed maintain the succession and the valid Eucharist. As for the "several Episcopalian bishops received consecration from Jansenist bishops...., please! This gets back to my constant focus on Hell. I insist in my own life on erring on the side of prudence on any matter as the risk I run if I am wrong is too horrific to contemplate. Sometimes, instead of exchanging comments on a serious Catholic site, I feel I am exchanging opinions at a Rotary lunch. - Manfred Tue, 15 Jan 2013 08:14:47 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15384 Manfred is a little too broad, when he says, “ non-Catholic Christians were declared to not have churches but rather faith communities.” In fact, Dominus Jesus [17] says “The Churches which, while not existing in perfect communion with the Catholic Church, remain united to her by means of the closest bonds, that is, by apostolic succession and a valid Eucharist, are true particular Churches.” As far as the Episcopal Church is concerned, around the beginning of the last century, several Episcopalian bishops received consecration from Janesnist bishops of the Union of Utrecht, whose orders are valid; something that post-dated Leo XIII’s judgment, which complicates the issue. - Michael Paterson-Seymour Tue, 15 Jan 2013 05:20:18 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15383 It's quite revealing of America's descent into depravity that while 400,000 people turn out in France to protest against same-sex "marriage" that there are virtually no like demonstrations in America. Meanwhile, as the First and Second Amendments are being eroded day by day by the Obama Regime the masses are otherwise diverted by the sins of a bicycle rider seeking public forgiveness kneeling before the TV altar of the nation's mother confessor. - Grump Tue, 15 Jan 2013 05:20:15 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15382 A very fine article. Amusing! Helpful! Does Gov. O'Malley receive communion? Yes, we might be waiting a long time for the recognitions and reparations. But better late than never, n'est-ce pas? Keep up the good work. - Dan Deeny Tue, 15 Jan 2013 04:58:43 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15381 Only Polyphobes think marriage is for two.. (Even though evil doesn't exist, you literally have to be an evil bigot to disagree with me.) - Jacob R Tue, 15 Jan 2013 03:36:32 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15380 How's this for a response? "How fortunate for you! Soon you can start enjoying those grandchildren." - Richard A Tue, 15 Jan 2013 03:00:55 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15379 Thank you for an informative article, Dr. Arkes. I have just a few small points I would like to add. You capitalize the first c in Episcopal Church. Leo XIII made it clear-the Episcopal churchmen do not enjoy faculties-they separated from the True Church. This was again brought up in Dominus Jesus in 2,000 where non-Catholic Christians were declared to not have churches but rather faith communities. You seem to give the Episcopalians more authority than they possess. Do not forget that it was the Episcopalian counterpart, the Anglicans, who broke with the condemnation on contraception at Lambeth in 1930 triggering Casti Connubii by Pius XI. My last point is EXCOMMUNICATION. If the Church refuses to excommunicate figures such as O'Malley, Biden, Pelosi, Sebelius, the Cuomos (pere et fils) et al., then the Church has made Itself a paper tiger and It and Its members will be paying a terrible price as It/we are swept into the dustbin of history. It is obvious that this task is beyond the leadership of the Church, Bp Filardi excluded, and that only Divine intervention brought by conversion and prayer will save us. - Manfred Tue, 15 Jan 2013 02:55:17 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15378 When citizens of one country, say Algeria, enter into a marriage there that is actually or potentially polygamous and then come to settle in, say, France, where marriage is strictly monogamous, the courts have to ask themselves whether the relationship between a man and the ladies living under his protection in a polygamous union is sufficiently analogous to the relationship of husband and wife, as described in the Code Civil, to make it just to apply the same rules to them. Otherwise, there is a real danger of the courts creating obligations, rather than enforcing them. The same question can arise in relation to succession to moveable and immoveable property, the owners of which are citizens of and domiciled in a foreign country No jurist has suggested there is an easy answer to this. The analogy with same-sex marriages is obvious enough. - Michael Paterson-Seymour Tue, 15 Jan 2013 02:32:13 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15377 "I am dejected, seized by desolation. Is there no balm in Gilead? Can no physician be found?" - Bangwell Putt Tue, 15 Jan 2013 02:21:42 +0100 http://www.thecatholicthing.org/columns/2013/notes-for-the-etiquette-of-a-new-age.html#comment-15376 This new age " "the way things are these days" and on and on...we need to fight this immoral stance. This is one of the reasons i get so offended when people claim to be "Episcoopal" is Roman Catholic "Light", NOTHING COULD BE FURTHER FROM THE TRUTH! jack - Jack,CT Tue, 15 Jan 2013 02:15:10 +0100